UK Karting - Notice Board (General Karting) : Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment....

Notice Board (General Karting)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment....
Posted by 'SimonS' on 25 Feb 2015 @ 01:11

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SimonSJoined: December 2004
Total Posts: 4
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"Firstly, why the sh*tty tone for the reply to my part?"

If you read a sh*tty tone, then you read wrongly.
I have posted a contrary opinion to yours and you see that as 'sh*tty'? That's exactly why I asked whether you were prepared to debate or were simply stating your opinion.

"Why the resistance to reducing number of classes and levering the prices down with suppliers? "

You cannot do both. If you hand someone a monopoly, then they will behave like monopolists. Official price controls don't work, governments can't make them work with business (and I lived through the 'Brain Drain' when Wage and Price control was national policy and all but bankrupt the country. Even now politicians create havoc on the market by promising to control prices of various goods. This usually means that they are going to give the businesses concerned a huge subsidy to maintain a 'political' price that their voters will find acceptable. Which government department is going to subsidise karting?

In other threads we have people who state that the only way to lower prices is to increase the number of traders by reintroducing 'tuning and allow competitive pricing.

Both policies cannot be right, though both can be wrong!

One area where you may have been mislead is to consider that there is no other choice for the various classes, that they have to stay 'MSA'.

Let's make it very plain, the MSA has no significant USP any more. At one time they had the cachet of awarding 'national' titles and negotiating with the CIK/FIA over international standards. As various people have pointed out, that horse is dead. If you make a popular class 'illegal' at MSA races, then the class can simply shift to IKR. Indeed, most traders probably have as many, if not more, clients in IKR than they do in 'MSA'.

If enough drivers walk away from MSA racing because it is being run for the benefit of a tiny number of elite drivers who might do international racing, might win an international trophy, then clubs will shut down, are already shutting down.

As one track owner pointed out, a single full commercial grid on a Saturday morning makes more profit for him than the whole of a SuperOne meeting from Thursday through Sunday!

"Am I a trader?"

No, I definitely am not a trader. I do have a grasp of budgets and company economics though.

"Cannot see how anyone can really argue about controlling costs on components made of "exotic" materials."

However, your understanding of exotic materials and mine are considerably different. Magnesium alloy isn't exotic, not compared to metal matrix composites, or carbon fibre grid reinforced tubing and similar variations. The price of mag alloy components has nothing to do with the material costs, but the price people are willing to pay for what they see as an advantage. (and, as is often discussed here, the performance advantage isn't something that can be undeniably demonstrated, nor supported by design calculations but often rely on the driver being able to create the conditions where an advantage occurs.

"You cannot be serious about discussing safety of helmets when you suggest buying a Ł100 helmet off Ebay?"

Have you read the certification requirements for helmets? Do you think that Bell, for example, considerably exceed those standards in a helmet that costs Ł500, and exceeds the Ł500 standards by a factor of 10 if you buy a Ł5000 helmet?
Pricing has nothing to do with standards and everything to do with what the customer will pay for their perception of the product. It's why companies pay public figures to advertise their wares.

" but one marked set per meeting and levering the buying power by consolidating the number of suppliers cannot be a bad idea surely - standard purchasing strategy?"

Except that as soon as that happens (and it has in the past) the importer negotiates different prices for the tyres with each trader. The trader's margin falls to the point that he has to raise prices in other goods or go out of business. How do you mandate that the tyre importer remains independent of political alliances with other traders, doesn't take a backhander for example to put a particular trader out of business?

Various sources have said that the karting committees of the MSA are the most difficult bunch of egos in the whole of motorsport, others have given up positions on these committees to protest at the way they are subverted to meet the agenda of certain alliances. Screwing over non-allied traders would be second nature to them, if only because once they were squeezed out the prices could go up! These are the committees who would set that 'maximum' price you were talking about: poacher and gamekeeper at the same time.

Message Thread:

decline in kart racing by 'gaz47' (16 Feb 2015 @ 17:51)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'AgedRacer' (17 Feb 2015 @ 10:03)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'd-i-y71' (17 Feb 2015 @ 10:10)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'emmajack2014' (17 Feb 2015 @ 11:51)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'gaz47' (17 Feb 2015 @ 13:40)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'd-i-y71' (17 Feb 2015 @ 13:55)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'Novicekart65' (17 Feb 2015 @ 15:02)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'emmajack2014' (17 Feb 2015 @ 15:08)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'karter212000' (17 Feb 2015 @ 15:28)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'BanzaiBoy' (17 Feb 2015 @ 17:04)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'brierleys' (18 Feb 2015 @ 9:10)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'TiredDad' (18 Feb 2015 @ 9:27)

decline in kart racing go dads and lad racing by 'PortlandBill' (18 Feb 2015 @ 9:44)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'richpudd2003' (18 Feb 2015 @ 9:49)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'BanzaiBoy' (18 Feb 2015 @ 11:13)

Richpudd is 100% correct (nt) by 'iant' (18 Feb 2015 @ 15:02)

Re: decline in kart racing by 'pegassuss22' (18 Feb 2015 @ 19:08)

Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct (nt) by 'iant' (18 Feb 2015 @ 20:07)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'faster' (18 Feb 2015 @ 20:29)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'pegassuss22' (18 Feb 2015 @ 21:00)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'christkm' (18 Feb 2015 @ 21:56)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'pegassuss22' (18 Feb 2015 @ 22:13)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'christkm' (18 Feb 2015 @ 23:05)

Re: Pegassuss - another person who's 100% correct by 'pegassuss22' (18 Feb 2015 @ 23:20)

Car racing is cheaper by 'MattCortes' (19 Feb 2015 @ 8:20)

Car racing isn't cheaper by 'nitch' (19 Feb 2015 @ 8:34)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'MattCortes' (19 Feb 2015 @ 8:49)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'nitch' (19 Feb 2015 @ 9:09)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'colin' (19 Feb 2015 @ 9:39)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'kai' (19 Feb 2015 @ 10:07)

Re: IKR & MSA Fulbeck by 'TeamPoor' (19 Feb 2015 @ 10:33)

Re: IKR & MSA Fulbeck by 'SkintFather' (19 Feb 2015 @ 11:11)

Re: IKR & MSA Fulbeck by 'TeamPoor' (20 Feb 2015 @ 13:52)

Re: IKR & MSA Fulbeck by 'SkintFather' (20 Feb 2015 @ 18:14)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'pegassuss22' (19 Feb 2015 @ 18:04)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'SimonS' (19 Feb 2015 @ 9:49)

simon S by 'BanzaiBoy' (19 Feb 2015 @ 11:37)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'itpro' (20 Feb 2015 @ 2:15)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'cjm2009' (19 Feb 2015 @ 13:59)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'colin' (19 Feb 2015 @ 17:03)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'pegassuss22' (19 Feb 2015 @ 18:08)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'PaulMRotax' (19 Feb 2015 @ 18:29)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'alanrr' (19 Feb 2015 @ 18:46)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'SkintFather' (19 Feb 2015 @ 18:51)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'christkm' (19 Feb 2015 @ 19:04)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'BanzaiBoy' (19 Feb 2015 @ 19:13)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'PaulMRotax' (19 Feb 2015 @ 19:59)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'pegassuss22' (19 Feb 2015 @ 20:05)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'alanrr' (23 Feb 2015 @ 23:31)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'BanzaiBoy' (19 Feb 2015 @ 19:09)

Re: intelligent measured post banzai by 'pegassuss22' (19 Feb 2015 @ 19:20)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'itpro' (19 Feb 2015 @ 23:29)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'alanrr' (19 Feb 2015 @ 23:48)

Re: Car racing isn't cheaper by 'itpro' (20 Feb 2015 @ 2:06)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'Bassman' (21 Feb 2015 @ 17:11)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'WWKarter' (21 Feb 2015 @ 22:01)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'alanrr' (21 Feb 2015 @ 22:09)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'SimonS' (22 Feb 2015 @ 10:09)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'alanrr' (21 Feb 2015 @ 22:15)

Re: Errr Banzai..... by 'dynamax' (22 Feb 2015 @ 10:59)

Re: the paddock atmosphere............ by 'pegassuss22' (22 Feb 2015 @ 13:26)

Re: the paddock atmosphere............ by 'kai' (22 Feb 2015 @ 14:12)

Technical problem by 'Minisueg' (22 Feb 2015 @ 17:36)

Re: Technical problem by 'TiredDad' (25 Feb 2015 @ 16:01)

Time, Money, and Enjoyment by 'Pauldalgarno' (23 Feb 2015 @ 10:56)

Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'Pauldalgarno' (23 Feb 2015 @ 10:58)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'alanrr' (23 Feb 2015 @ 16:06)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'PaulMRotax' (23 Feb 2015 @ 16:17)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'alanrr' (23 Feb 2015 @ 20:07)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'SimonS' (23 Feb 2015 @ 21:07)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'MaxRacewear' (23 Feb 2015 @ 23:01)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'christkm' (24 Feb 2015 @ 9:26)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'brierleys' (24 Feb 2015 @ 12:04)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'SimonS' (24 Feb 2015 @ 18:40)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'SimonS' (24 Feb 2015 @ 18:51)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'christkm' (24 Feb 2015 @ 20:24)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'SimonS' (24 Feb 2015 @ 18:42)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'pegassuss22' (24 Feb 2015 @ 20:57)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'Pauldalgarno' (24 Feb 2015 @ 21:44)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'MaxRacewear' (24 Feb 2015 @ 22:21)

Re: max racewear by 'pegassuss22' (24 Feb 2015 @ 22:38)

Re: max racewear by 'christkm' (24 Feb 2015 @ 22:43)

Re: max racewear by 'pegassuss22' (24 Feb 2015 @ 22:59)

Re: Time, Money, Enjoyment.... by 'SimonS' << You are here!

Simon by 'pegassuss22' (25 Feb 2015 @ 9:07)

Re: Simon by 'dynamax' (25 Feb 2015 @ 11:45)

Re: Simon by 'PortlandBill' (25 Feb 2015 @ 13:56)

Re: Simon by 'emmajack2014' (25 Feb 2015 @ 14:02)

Re: Simon by 'Novicekart65' (25 Feb 2015 @ 14:15)

Re: SimonS by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 9:23)

Re: SimonS by 'SimonS' (26 Feb 2015 @ 19:09)

Re: SimonS by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 19:44)

Novice-kart65 by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 9:30)

Pauldalgarno by 'dth07' (26 Feb 2015 @ 12:45)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'dynamax' (26 Feb 2015 @ 13:06)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'dth07' (26 Feb 2015 @ 17:06)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'pegassuss22' (26 Feb 2015 @ 19:34)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 19:47)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'pegassuss22' (26 Feb 2015 @ 20:10)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 21:02)

Re: Pauldalgarno by 'Pauldalgarno' (26 Feb 2015 @ 13:44)

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