UK Karting - Notice Board (General Karting) : Re: Lifting inside wheel

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Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide
Posted by 'RedDragonRacing' on 20 Aug 2012 @ 09:36

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RedDragonRacingJoined: August 2012
Total Posts: 1
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Simon,

Thank you so much for taking the time to elaborate, I have read through a couple of times already and will need to read through a number of times to make sure I get everything.

Rear track width is something I haven't quite come to grips with yet. I figured that with a center of gravity somewhere around the sternum, grabbing one rear wheel at a standstill and lifting it with the pilot in the kart, the force required to lift that wheel would be smaller if the other rear wheel was closer to the pilot. I.e., a narrow rear track would lift the inside rear wheel at lower G's around a corner than a wider rear track.

The need for the largest possible contact patch between the tire and the track is understood, and if you lift the inside wheel too much you will distort the tirewall and have less of a contact patch, thus the rear would start to slide and no wheel lift would be acheived.

Then again, with a narrow track the angle of the rear axle versus the ground would need to be greater in order to lift the inside wheel off the track, and I guess that is your point. Hope I got it right.

Haskenheim (Haasken, nicknamed after Hockenheim) is a nice track built cirka 2004, with new blacktop this year. Personally I think it is unfortunate that the chikane on the back straight was removed as there are no chikanes left to practise on.

Regarding driving technique, the pilot has been told to brake as hard as he can in a straigth line, never use both pedals at the same time, and softly get on the gas when he is done braking to stabilize the kart. Trailbraking is a bit too advanced for him at this stage I think. A good exersize to help him understand how much the kart decelerates when moving the steering wheel was to make him push the kart with a friend in the seat, and then make the friend turn the wheel. Pushing the kart got really heavy and the point was taken.

What I meant with positive camber was increasing the jacking effect, which should help lift the inside rear. If front end grip becomes a problem, a sligth negative camber with the pilot in the kart (maybe neutral with the kart on a trolley) is in order. Since most tracks are clockwise, please let me know if the brake and engine sides camber should be different.

You are correct about heavy steering, we rented a couple of gokarts while on vacation this summer, and my son's kart
s steering was so heavy he couldn't go fast.

Again, thanks for taking the time to answer, I'm looking forward to gaining a greater understanding of how gokarts work.

Message Thread:

Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (15 Aug 2012 @ 10:17)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'd-i-y71' (15 Aug 2012 @ 14:35)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Traxtar' (15 Aug 2012 @ 16:08)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Brasic' (15 Aug 2012 @ 22:43)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'buzzinrussell' (15 Aug 2012 @ 23:11)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (16 Aug 2012 @ 12:37)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Chris34' (16 Aug 2012 @ 15:38)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'BFD' (16 Aug 2012 @ 17:46)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'michaelg36' (16 Aug 2012 @ 23:34)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'BFD' (17 Aug 2012 @ 6:51)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 7:59)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'PoppaAl' (17 Aug 2012 @ 9:09)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Thebrick' (17 Aug 2012 @ 10:26)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Danlee' (17 Aug 2012 @ 11:31)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Chris34' (17 Aug 2012 @ 12:32)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'Traxtar' (17 Aug 2012 @ 12:53)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'd-i-y71' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:02)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:10)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:35)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'd-i-y71' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:53)

Errrr...... well...... by 'itpro' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:04)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:25)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'michaelg36' (17 Aug 2012 @ 13:53)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'BFD' (17 Aug 2012 @ 14:24)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'itpro' (17 Aug 2012 @ 14:41)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'itpro' (17 Aug 2012 @ 14:52)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 20:35)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'BFD' (17 Aug 2012 @ 21:05)

Red... by 'itpro' (18 Aug 2012 @ 0:57)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'RedDragonRacing' (20 Aug 2012 @ 9:50)

Re: BFD by 'Attack2001' (18 Aug 2012 @ 2:11)

Re: BFD by 'BFD' (18 Aug 2012 @ 18:55)

Re: BFD by 'Aquila' (19 Aug 2012 @ 22:01)

Re: BFD by 'BFD' (19 Aug 2012 @ 22:38)

Re: BFD by 'BFD' (19 Aug 2012 @ 23:27)

Come on BFD.......... by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 0:05)

Re: BFD by 'Aquila' (20 Aug 2012 @ 10:30)

Red.... by 'itpro' (17 Aug 2012 @ 14:36)

Re: Red.... by 'RedDragonRacing' (17 Aug 2012 @ 20:11)

re: itpro. wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong by 'BFD' (17 Aug 2012 @ 21:18)

re: itpro. wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong by 'itpro' (18 Aug 2012 @ 0:40)

re: itpro. wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong by 'richpudd2003' (19 Aug 2012 @ 23:51)

OK Red... I apologise for the idiots, though! by 'itpro' (18 Aug 2012 @ 0:34)

Re: Classic! by 'PoppaAl' (18 Aug 2012 @ 10:09)

Re: OK Red... I apologise for the idiots, though! by 'markmorton' (18 Aug 2012 @ 17:38)

Re: OK Red... I apologise for the idiots, though! by 'RedDragonRacing' (20 Aug 2012 @ 9:57)

Re: Red.... by 'RedDragonRacing' (27 Aug 2012 @ 9:58)

Re: Red.... by 'John' (28 Aug 2012 @ 8:14)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (30 Aug 2012 @ 1:46)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (30 Aug 2012 @ 6:48)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (30 Aug 2012 @ 17:42)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (30 Aug 2012 @ 20:57)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (30 Aug 2012 @ 21:04)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (31 Aug 2012 @ 0:48)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (31 Aug 2012 @ 7:15)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:37)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (31 Aug 2012 @ 18:24)

Re: Red.... by 'Aquila' (31 Aug 2012 @ 18:28)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (02 Sep 2012 @ 1:14)

Re: Red.... by 'Traxtar' (02 Sep 2012 @ 20:19)

Re: Red.... by 'BFD' (02 Sep 2012 @ 22:14)

Re: Red.... by 'Traxtar' (02 Sep 2012 @ 22:24)

Traxtar..... by 'itpro' (03 Sep 2012 @ 1:36)

Re: Traxtar..... by 'BFD' (03 Sep 2012 @ 7:51)

Re: Traxtar..... by 'sawf' (03 Sep 2012 @ 10:28)

Re: Red.... by 'PaulMRotax' (31 Aug 2012 @ 7:58)

Re: Red.... by 'John' (31 Aug 2012 @ 8:37)

Re: Red.... by 'PaulMRotax' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:19)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:31)

Re: Red.... by 'PaulMRotax' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:35)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:39)

Re: Red.... by 'PaulMRotax' (31 Aug 2012 @ 11:51)

Re: Red.... by 'itpro' (31 Aug 2012 @ 12:27)

Re: Red.... by 'PaulMRotax' (31 Aug 2012 @ 12:30)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'NJB' (23 Aug 2012 @ 17:11)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'RedDragonRacing' (27 Aug 2012 @ 9:47)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'Andy99' (30 Aug 2012 @ 9:56)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'RedDragonRacing' (30 Aug 2012 @ 10:26)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'Liam' (21 Aug 2012 @ 14:18)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 15:57)

Re: Errrr...... well...... by 'Liam' (21 Aug 2012 @ 20:54)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'SimonS' (18 Aug 2012 @ 12:13)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' << You are here!

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'itpro' (20 Aug 2012 @ 10:43)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'SimonS' (21 Aug 2012 @ 1:49)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 2:20)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'd-i-y71' (21 Aug 2012 @ 12:53)

Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'RedDragonRacing' (21 Aug 2012 @ 13:18)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 16:42)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Liam' (21 Aug 2012 @ 20:43)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 20:51)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Liam' (21 Aug 2012 @ 21:08)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Traxtar' (21 Aug 2012 @ 22:49)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Liam' (21 Aug 2012 @ 23:56)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'richpudd2003' (22 Aug 2012 @ 0:36)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Liam' (22 Aug 2012 @ 2:09)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'itpro' (22 Aug 2012 @ 10:34)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'richpudd2003' (22 Aug 2012 @ 11:47)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'Traxtar' (22 Aug 2012 @ 12:20)

Re: Is wheel lift only from turn-in till apex? by 'RedDragonRacing' (22 Aug 2012 @ 10:37)

Re: Possibly better video to highlight steer angle by 'NikG' (22 Aug 2012 @ 15:16)

Re: Possibly better video to highlight steer angle by 'Traxtar' (22 Aug 2012 @ 15:23)

Re: Possibly better video to highlight steer angle by 'NikG' (22 Aug 2012 @ 15:38)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'd-i-y71' (20 Aug 2012 @ 12:40)

Perfect weigth distribution? by 'RedDragonRacing' (20 Aug 2012 @ 10:03)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'itpro' (20 Aug 2012 @ 11:10)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'RedDragonRacing' (21 Aug 2012 @ 12:27)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'itpro' (21 Aug 2012 @ 16:02)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'Traxtar' (21 Aug 2012 @ 17:21)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'BFD' (21 Aug 2012 @ 18:53)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'Farrang' (21 Aug 2012 @ 19:16)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'RedDragonRacing' (22 Aug 2012 @ 10:51)

Re: Perfect weigth distribution? by 'Aquila' (21 Aug 2012 @ 22:09)

good to see a lively debate.... by 'NJB' (22 Aug 2012 @ 8:07)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'itpro' (22 Aug 2012 @ 10:37)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'BFD' (22 Aug 2012 @ 18:01)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'EtheT' (24 Aug 2012 @ 15:55)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'BFD' (24 Aug 2012 @ 17:28)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'richpudd2003' (24 Aug 2012 @ 18:03)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'BFD' (24 Aug 2012 @ 23:08)

Re: good to see a lively debate.... by 'Traxtar' (25 Aug 2012 @ 0:46)

Re: Lifting inside wheel - beginner's guide by 'RedDragonRacing' (01 Oct 2012 @ 15:49)

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